BEST of the BETS

Let me begin.

Sunderland Sam team FLAT

So very strange

Pity TVR is not posting for 6 months, he would be right up for this.

Quality!

I love both but something about the jumps just gets me that bit more excited!

i hate the jumps cart horses and loads of fallers
just with voice was back so we could take piss out of him like old days

Definitely Jumps for me

Cart horses Joe? And these 0-55 races on the AW are sheer quality! saw a meeting at wolv two weeks ago with 5 class 6 and 2 class 5...quality!

And if you take the time to work out who CAN jump, you will win money! Royal Ascot V Cheltenham? No contest, although at Ascot you can see famed horse racing fan and intellectual Tommy Robinson (or Stephen Christopher Yaxley-Lennon, known by the pseudonym Tommy Robinson, and previously as Andrew McMaster and Paul Harris) scrapping with other intellectuals!

I actually like both but am fed up with flat racing being swamped by AW non events that are essentially run to keep the bookies open so they can rob the poor with their FOBTs. i am a member at Windsor and Sandown, my favourite tracks!

I think the jump racing cruel thats just my opinion flogging knackered horses to jump for entertainment and betting over extreme distances they cant handle in most cases.

So what if its sand /grass or whatever and whatever level c1 c7
Its just a race between similar level horses where there is an outcome be it for 2k or 100k

The only diff i can see is in top level races say 90% try in lower lever i guess 50
but in top level only say 25% can win in c6 anyone can win.
figures guesstimates :razz:

we all have different opinions but i find your guesstimates questionable especially about triers and non triers. Eg a Group 1 race where the owners are largely non gamblers and price money not important. they will ALL be trying their hardest as owners tend to be sportsmen (although stinking rich!) and its all about prestiege whereas a class 6, 80% (my guestimate!) wont be trying as they are desperate to fiddle their handicap marks for another day! Who would you trust more, John Gosden or David Evans?

Also "cruel" and "flogging knackered horses" seems harsh to jumps. Those class 6 horses arent good enough to run so they are being flogged to death to land a coup! Also flat horses are routinely dropped after their 3 year old career and only the best get to breed, the majority ending up in (fantastic) places like Greatwood or at worst, on the menu in Paris or Barcelona! Jump horses run for years and years as there is no money attached to breeding as they have had their gear removed. season after season you see the horses and thats why there is a greater affinity between jump horses and fans than flat.

Also im guessing you have never been to a jumps yard? The lads and girls love their horses and so do the owners with most horses spending the summer with their owners and not at the racing stables. One of the best trainers ever, Nicky henderson is an emotional man and cares about every horse whether they are in care or not. Evans will run them over and over again til they drop. The jumps crowd also seem to show more empathy with a horse and jockey. If a horse falls the crowd do not run off to collect their winnings or have a drink, they wait to see its ok. i remember Atlaal, a huge outsider for John Jenkings, falling athe 2nd last at Ascot after leading the classy grade 1 field to the 2nd last. Sadly the screens went up and stayed up for 25 mins with everyone fearing the worse. NOONE left the stands despite the hot fav winning and you could hear a pin drop. And ill never forget the small ripple of applause that started and turned into a crescendo as the screens were removed and the horse got up. the horse had been badly winded. But the site of 4 or 5 stable girls hugging in tears and Jenkins acknowledging the crowd through his own tears will live with me for a long time. The horse was led back in front of the stands with everyone cheering and clapping as if it had won the Gold Cup.

But your comment i think, sums up the difference in me and you ie "So what if its sand /grass or whatever and whatever level c1 c7 Its just a race between similar level horses where there is an outcome be it for 2k or 100k" You are obviously only interested in the betting and not the sport itself. i love the sport and betting is a pastime but going to the races ( i go to approx 50 meetings a year), the thrill of it, the love and care about the horses, the near madness daredevil of the jump jockey makes it an amazing sport. yes, betting is fun, but not the be all and end all, thus watching a class 6 on a flapping track is not my cup of tea

Absolutely spot on hippp well said

I dont think they are all trying in group races , some are pace makers some are second string some are just there to pick up place money some are there to put other horses off , or give the mega rich owners a fancy day out hence the 90% guess
its probably a lot less.

Many of the decent jump horses are flat bred and often failures on the flat then there is the cart horse brigade

I used to care about it as a sport , but not any more

What. A load of old bAilocks! You dont give a toss about anything or snybody excrpt your pocket! And the funfair that is the aw suits your lack of racing knowledge as uou can dometimes guess whos turn it is!

Ive watched you over the years try and kill any racing debate on here with your acid comments and bating. And before you post your sillu fishing video sgain, grow up! If you hate racing thst much stop posting and switch to a proper troll site.

And yes im expecting your usual tirade of abuse that inevitably will follow.

nd for the record Many Clouds, this one of my favourite horses and he litteraly ran his heart out doing what he loved. The sherwoods are still devaststed and everyone in the yard was in rears. So not sure whst the ooint of posting this video? Many horses dont lice past 4...clouds had a long and happy career

All horses are ran for people to profit. All punters are in it to try make money. I would say all people wish no harm to come to a horse.
Yes, the trainers and stable staff adore they horses, but whichever way you look at it they are also in it to try and make money so punters and trainers, owners are ultimately wanting the same thing.
Money makes the world go round. It's as simple as that really and any view to the contrary is just utter lies and buffonery.

Owners make money? Are you kidding? Ever owned a horse? less than 10% of owners make money. This is where avid punters are wrong. Certainly in the jumps world its almost impossible to make money as an owner...ask JP...he writes off millions every year fgs! Bsically a trainer will tell you to write off your investment from day 1. Sure you may have a pick up or two from the odd bet and/or prize money...my 4 friends had a horse once (on the flat) called Salty Jack with Vic Soane and then David Elsworth (after Vic pulled off his coup with My Best Valentine in the Prix D'Abbeye in Paris...we had been backing it at 100/1 the last 3 weeks before the race, Vic had backed it all year!.... and gave up training there and then!). Now Jack was a damn good horse in its grade (once 2nd in the Bunbury Cup in 1999 and always in the big hcaps). It won £109k in prize money...total cost to them £174k, so even with a few win bets (had a better strike record than most) they were vastly out of pocket! But that wasnt why they were in the game, Yes the thrills and spills of raceday and betting was a magnet but it was to see their boy run. Thats why they were in it. They were always over in lambourn with the kids etc...it was a family horse. Theyve owned many more since, none particularly successful, but they have had immense joy and worth every penny of the huge loss theyve mad! point was, they could afford it so money DIDNT matter and thats what youll find with most owners.

So money obnly makes some peoples world go round and you have picked the wron sport. even Coolmore return a huge loss each year as does Godolphin.

So yes i believe in lies and therefore must be a buffoon, but you and Joe know absolutely nothing about sport. all you know and feed is the greed and obsession that some sports attract (please see Joes ridiculous poll about wishing horses to fall).

If owners etc are not bothered about the money aspect of the game then why just keep it as a pet and not run it at all? I'm sorry but you speak utter nonsense.
Coolmore, Godolphin etc are after the top class animal that brings them prestige and money. Yes, I can totally understand that they can make big losses as they are throwing s*it at the wall and hoping some of it will stick.
Also, in no way is Joe wishing for a horse to fall, in all likelihood he means 'fluff' as one member suggested. In fact I would say all members who took part in the poll mean't the same thing and would not wish any harm to a horse. You need to get your head out of that cloud you are in and see the facts.

I speak utter nonsense? "If owners etc are not bothered about the money aspect of the game then why just keep it as a pet and not run it at all?"...now id say thats utter nonsense!

As i said before , you have never owned a horse have you? 1st rule of ownership...WRITE OFF YOUR INVESTMENT = cost of horse plus training fees plus vets bills plus transport plus feed plus % towards running costs plus entry fees plus stabling (at course) fees = TOTAL LOSS!!!! Even when you win youre lucky to end up with 35% OF THE WINNINGS BY THE TIME THE JOCKEY, TRAINER AND STAFF (QUITE RIGHTLY SO FOR STAFF) TAKE THEIR SHARE.

Is this utter nonsense or simply something you dont know or understand. You my friend are in cloud cuckoo land.

For the last time (and ask any owner), they make a loss, they expect to make a loss...so WHY the outlay? prestiege, the thrill of ownership, the day at the races, the visits to the stables (come to lambourn, youd be made very welcome..err probably not!), having a bet on YOUR horse, the chat with the jockeys, the thrill of maybe on tele and of course the dream of winning a big one!

So you and Joes bitter and twisted view thats its money money money is totally wrong. Dont tar everyboard with your brush, millions love their racing and it could do without heartless, self centred chaps like you two!

And if you see when Joes Poll thread appears, it is just after his mud slinging at me when i pointed out owners and punters do care about their horses. He was trying to be sarcastic with the poll to prove a point! and the irony is that the brain of britain, SS (or TRV as most know him) has bought it , hook, line and sinker! Happy days!

"But this is not an investment for the faint-hearted. You are unlikely to make a fortune and could end up losing a huge amount of money. The Racehorse Owners Association says that for every £100 of annual outlay (not including the purchase cost of the horse), a racehorse owner is likely to see a return of just £21" Daily Telegraph

.

Hippo
I have been reading your posts and tips here and on other boards over the past 12 years so take this the way it is meant,

Calm down and have a cuppa with a choccy biscuit.

you will feel better.

Choccy biscuits all eaten! Moved on to valium!